Peddling the moronic pop psych standup theory
In an interview with alt rag The LAist, Matt Belknap (creator of website ASpecialThing.com) perpetuates the trite nonsense that comics have “an above average need for attention,” which “might come from childhood neglect,” and that comics came to their skills by trying to “gain the attention of an otherwise distant parent.”
We grow weary of this.
Can we finally put this moronic, hackneyed set of hypotheses to rest? Who buys this shit but people who are predisposed to dislike comedians in the first place? Who benefits but those who wish to feel superior to standup comics (i.e., reporters, the envious, the utterly humorless, people who depend on clichés to order their world)?
It’s particularly disheartening to hear this psychobabble coming from someone who has set himself up as an expert on standup. (The reporter loves it. The reporter comes to the interview believing it. And even we have been guilty– in the dark, distant past– of saying something merely because we are sure the reporter wants to hear it. This stems not so much from a need to please, but a desire for publicity.)
But Belknap says it more than once:
I would guess that all performers of all stripes have an above-average need for attention, so that’s the first ingredient. This might come from childhood neglect…
And
A lot of people think comics must have had fucked-up childhoods. Some do, but I think that assumption is backwards: I think those comics are people who survived fucked-up childhoods by using their humor as a shield. The comics who didn’t have notably fucked-up childhoods are just people who like the feeling of making people laugh (and the attention that comes with it).
And
…a comic has either spent his whole life feeling like he needs to perform and make people laugh to get the attention he craves, or he’s gotten a taste of the highs of live performance and can’t resist chasing that feeling.
It is quite clear: Proficiency at making folks laugh is a pathology. It is somewhat akin to heroin addiction or chronic masturbation. It’s often rooted in a malformed childhood. Or it’s a palliative for a painful childhood or a failure to connect with a parent.
This fantasy is right up there with the overbearing mother/distant father formula for gayness. Haven’t you heard the news? Freud is sooo last century.
The second quote offers some clue as to why this garbage is peddled. We thoughfully boldified the money quote, and we repeat it here:
The comics who didn’t have notably fucked-up childhoods are just people who like the feeling of making people laugh (and the attention that comes with it).
If your humor doesn’t come from pain (and if your motive is purely to make people laugh), your standup has no hope of achieving the status of art. Conversely, if your humor derives from pain (and you are a tortured soul), congratuations, you are an artiste. And the corollary: If you had a happy childhood and you become a standup comic, you’re an attention whore. If you had a “fucked up childhood” and you become a comic, you deserve all the attention you can get.
Earlier in the article, Belknap flatly states that “all standup comedy is art.” But in the next sentence, he dismisses a good chunk of standup by saying that “a percentage of it is striving to be nothing more than escapist entertainment, a mindless reaffirmation of commonly held beliefs.” Just what percentage of standup is “merely escapist” or mindless Belknap doesn’t say.
23 Responses
Reply to: Peddling the moronic pop psych standup theory
I think you’re reading a lot of things he didn’t actually say. He made no judgement of what is artistic, nor did he endorse the theory that all comics are messed up.But how can you deny that performs are people who want attention? Why else get on stage if you don’t want people to notice and pay attention to you?
We’ve been in this business for a looong time and we don’t encounter comics who “crave attention” all that often.Most comics– the vast majority in our experience– are humble, modest, quiet offstage. And they don’t really think about the “attention” all that much. They do standup for a multitude of reasons, but “Hey, look at me!” is always very low on the list, if it’s on there at all.We get onstage, not to be noticed, but to make the audience laugh.Often, when offered stage time, we’ll decline. How much can we be craving attention if we’re capable of turning it down?As far as “reading a lot of things he didn’t actually say,” the statements between the quote marks are stuff he actually said. (It was an email interview.) This magazine used to conduct email interviews– and our subjects often agreed for that very reason. We would pitch the subject on the idea by saying, “We conduct the interview by email so that there’s no way you’ll be misquoted. We take your answers and, with very minimal editing but for punctuation and spelling, we dump it directly into the magazine.” (In fact, for Mitch Hedberg’s interview, we didn’t even correct for punctuation.)
A need for attention is not the same as having a big ego. It’s not a bad thing want attention. Matt is not saying that comedians are a bunch of whiny 8 year-olds. He’s just pointing out that a part of any performer’s personality is the need for validation. It’s not a human flaw, it’s how some people bring meaning to their lives.
I think Matt’s saying exactly the opposite of the stereotype you’re describing. You’re misinterpreting his comments terribly.I’d encourage people to read the interview and note that what Matt’s saying is that there are lots of reasons people get into standup and comedy in general, and that essentially, people who get into standup do it because they enjoy performing and making people laugh. Which is, in my experience, true.I understand that this is a sore subject for you, as a comic myself, but get a grip! You’re reading this through whatever the opposite is of rose colored glasses.
nathansmart said:“It’s not a bad thing (to) want attention.”Ah, but examine the statement:“I would guess that all performers of all stripes have an above-average need for attention, so that’s the first ingredient. This might come from childhood neglect…”He doesn’t say that comics want attention. He doesn’t say that comics enjoy attention.He says that comics <>need<>, that comics <>crave<> attention. This goes beyond analyzing a comic’s motivation. This (and the other statements) puts it firmly into the realm of pathology.The last blockquoted paragraph in the posting uses the same lingo that is used to describe junkies. Are you comfortable with someone characterizing comedians this way?We’re also rather uncomfortable with audience members observing us, and concluding that:1. we’re patheticor2. we’ve been neglected by our parents.We don’t deserve that kind of reputation and neither do our parents.
oh, relax
Belknap is a blight upon comedy and must be stamped out. Ready the pitchforks, men!
I understand why you don’t like necessarily the stereotyping of comics, but you know…so what?Every art form – every single one – has the same stereotype. Painters. Filmmakers. Musicians. Writers. All of them have the stereotype of being dysfunctional individuals who persue their art form because of some need, some craving.Is it right? Nope, not in many cases.But I don’t really see what the point of the fight is. So we want people to know that comics go home, kiss their wives and husband, play with their kids, mow their lawn, etc. Sounds good. Sounds accurate.But the problem is… for people who don’t create – who aren’t performers or artists – the creative impulse is a mystery. It’s one to always going to be explained by some extreme. Some need. Some desire that goes beyond what “typical” human experience is.You’re not fighting stand-up stereotyping here, you’re fighting how people think about all creators. And there are enough cases – particularly with some of the biggest names in the art form – where the comics have met with bad ends, had flawed childhoods or felt some tragedy put an imprint of them.The bad experiences of stand-ups are not more unique to them – they’re common, if not more common, in the general public. But because of what comics do and because performing is so personal, the flaws in their lives are more important to their work than they are to an accountant. And no amount of jumping up and down and saying “We’re normal!” is going to change that.
I wish this hurtful stereotype about black people being good dancers would go away. Black people can’t dance at all because I know plenty of black people and they all tell me they can’t dance for shit!Myth: Busted.
It wasn’t us who introduced the concept of “childhood neglect” or “craving.”Try for a moment to put yourself in the position of someone who is not a comedian reading those words.It can’t be read as positive.We would say that it is you, Jesse, who is seeing/reading/hearing what you want to see/read/hear.
If there’s one stereotype about comedians that we can gather from this exchange it’s that they get super-defensive over something that needs no defending.Matt is not the enemy here guys! He is supporting stand up comedy in so many ways.. just relax.He made an observation (a very BROAD one at that), you said that his observation was incorrect. I’m sure you both can show plenty of examples of comedians that both fit and don’t fit the stereotype. And that’s it.Don’t make Matt out to be some dumb New York Times/Maxim douchebag ragging on something they don’t know about. Matt has considerable experience with the subject and so do you. Both viewpoints can be vaild.
Todd Jackson comments:“The bad experiences of stand-ups are not more unique to them – they’re common, if not more common, in the general public.”We would disagree.Todd further comments:“And no amount of jumping up and down and saying ‘We’re normal!’ is going to change that.”Actually, we’re not jumping up and down… and we’re not saying that we’re especially normal.What we are saying is that the real stories, the real motivations of comedians, while not particularly shot through with angst or heartache or tragedy, are still rather interesting if we actually get past the cliches, the tropes, the tired truisms.There seems to be an embarassing tendency on the part of the media and consumers of the media (and, sadly, on the part some comedians) to swallow this ludicrous notion that we’re all wounded. That we’re all damaged goods. And that our scar tissue and our constant efforts to make up for some childhood neglect (for instance) is what makes us do comedy.This makes us seem one-dimensional, cliched, stereotypical.And the reason we see it repeated so often is not, as some might suspect, because it’s true. We would attribute it to a startling laziness on the part of the press.The truth is somewhere in between. And is far more interesting than that which Belknap (and his defenders) want to believe (or want the public to believe).We’ve been writing about these stories, these motivations, for nine years now. Since 1999, we’ve talked to comics and asked them enough questions and kicked the answers around enough that we are convinced that the attention whore theory and its variations are untrue and that we deserve a far more nuanced analysis. We don’t jump up and down. Like we said, we grow weary.
let’s be fair – nowhere in the interview does matt “set himself up as an expert on standup” or claim to be such. flagging his comments as moronic and hackneyed is more than a bit harsh. finally, how can you misinterpret this: “a lot of people think comics must have had fucked-up childhoods. some do, but i think that assumption is backwards”?? it seems pretty clear to me that he’s not embracing the stereotypes that you’re accusing him of perpetuating.
<>“And is far more interesting than that which Belknap (and his defenders) want to believe <>(or want the public to believe)<>.”<>You clearly don’t know who Matt Belknap is and the easiest way to find out what he really meant in that interview is to email him (which you didn’t for this story) or go to aspecialthing.com and join in the discussion.
Dear SHECKYmagazine,Get out of the business.Thanks!
I actually think there merit to the idea we have an above average need for attention. I think we fall in love with how we feel when we crack someone up. We were born with the talents needed to become a comedian and just do what comes naturally to us just as person born with a good voice usually finds a way to sing. No big mystery as far as I’m concerned
You keep saying it’s the press, but is Belknap part of the press? I can’t speak for other members of the press, but when I ask a question, I’m not looking for a response to fit my world view. It seems, as you pointed out, that too many comics believe what Belknap says, too. And lots of your commenters. If reporters are constantly being told this by their interview subjects, what else are they to believe? But I also think when someone says “all x are y”, we can take it as hyperbole rather than literal truth.
from SDFA:<>Dear SHECKYmagazine,Get out of the business.Thanks!<>This is a ridiculous response. I disagree with Traci and Brian on their take here, but they’re both talented, accomplished comics who genuinely love the art and craft of standup and comedy writing. Don’t be stupid.from Schecky:<>As far as “reading a lot of things he didn’t actually say,” the statements between the quote marks are stuff he actually said.<>But you also left out some other stuff he said, like about how all standup is art. He didn’t make the judgement that any one type of comedy is art and another is not. I just think you’re being hyper-sensitive about this.
I didn’t mean the comedy business. I just think that it’s time for them to stop peddling SHECKYwebsite and take their “editors/publishers” title to another medium of expression. Technical writing… Technical writing agents… Something with shovel handle assembly?? Who knows?“SHECKYmagazine has been featured in the Wall Street Journal, USA Today, the Boston Globe and on NPR’s All Things Considered. They are recognized as experts on the art, the craft, the business and the lifestyle of standup comedy.”LOLYou don’t write good, you just write a fucking lot.
Excuse me, this is a debate about a specific topic. Please leave whatever personal enmity you have for Brian and Traci at the door, or in your hope chest, or buried in the basement with your bomb-making materials.Nobody’s forcing you to read this.And it’s “You don’t write <>well<>,” fucktard.
Oh, yeah! Curtin’s got our back.Thanks, Curtin.P.S.: We’re fairly sure there’s no personal enmity there. After all, it doesn’t sign its name. And, if you click on the moniker “sdfa,” no profile exists.We suspect it might be the Saskatchewan Dried Flower Association… or perhaps it’s Speech Driven Facial Animation.Say what you will, disagree if you will with us or with Mr. Belknap, but one thing is true (and it’s true of most of our commenters, too): We sign our name to our opinions. There is much to be said for that.Thanks again, Jon and thanks to all who commented.
I have been working along side Matt Belknap for 2 years on the highly successful podcast “Never Not Funny” (which is available at http://www.pardcast.com, BTW) and I can assure you he is a stand-up guy who has nothing but respect for comedians and the craft of comedy. He was asked, based on his many interviews with comics his opinion on why one would become a performer. While his answer may have trod familiar territory, I don’t think it’s that far off base. The mere idea that one gets onstage is proof of a need for attention.Hell, I’m a guy who says, “I just like making people laugh.” but obviously, I like to be acknowledged for it… otherwise I’d still be “the funny guy at the office”.
I’m a comic and in the federal witness protection program. The last thing i want is to be recognized on stage. Like most comics, I do it for the free drinks.