Reading (PA), writing and arithmetic
In the ten years we’ve published this magazine, we’ve rarely used this platform to air any personal grievances. It was never our intention to use it for that.
But once in a great while, we’re moved to relate a personal experience because we feel that it might serve as a cautionary tale. We hope that people might learn from our experience.
We were booked to perform in Reading, PA, on March 20-21, at the Reading Comedy Outlet. In purely logistical terms, it’s a sweet gig– 70 miles from home, back in our own bed by late Saturday night/early Sunday morning, and (from what we recall of the last time we were there almost ten years ago), decent, appreciative crowds.
On Sunday morning, when The Female Half was corresponding with a friend (who happened to be performing at that very venue this past weekend), the friend mentioned that she was invited back to the club to open for Ben Bailey in March. Bailey had just canceled his scheduled Feb. 27-28 engagement at the club and he was immediately re-scheduled… for a date in March.
Since we had our own date in March, we momentarily feared that it was our weekend that Bailey had been re-scheduled to. But, since we hadn’t heard anything from Reading, we assumed it was on another weekend.
We assumed wrong.
By Sunday afternoon, we confirmed from our friend that Bailey had indeed been re-scheduled… to March 20-21. Our date.
Rather than wait for a phone call, we called the Reading Comedy Outlet proprietor Todd Hiester to find out what the situation was. (We left a pleasant, businesslike voicemail on Heister’s phone on Sunday evening, asking what the deal was and inquiring as to whether there would be any compensation in the event that we were, in fact, canceled.)
While we were taxiing to the gate in PHL this morning, we checked our V.M. and were treated to a message from Hiester, explaining that we were indeed canceled. But we were assured that we had “plenty of time” to re-book the date at another club and that there’s “no loss,” to us, and, as such, there would be no compensation. And, as he was willing to re-book us at the club at some unspecified time in the future, things were all better.
We got home and sent an email and expressed our disappointment that we were canceled with so little advance, and that we were not informed of the cancellation sooner. And we were particularly annoyed that there would be no attempt to make good on the booking, other than some vague promise of a re-booking in the future.
We also expressed our shock that The Female Half wasn’t at the very least offered the feature spot. (Not that she would have taken it, but we were appalled that the offer wasn’t made.) We said that the entire affair could have been “handled a whole lot better.”
The email we got back was not satisfactory. We’ll summarize:
“These things happen, as you well know.”
“The time to book something else is very doable.”
You are taking this personally.
Wow. Oh, sure, it was sweetened with an “I’m sorry” here and there, but the underlying message was “too bad.”
There’s a colloquialism (which was popularized by NYPD Blue‘s Det. Andy Sipowicz)– “Don’t piss on my shoes and tell me it’s raining.” In this case, we would have appreciated it if, as he was pissing on our shoes, he would have made at least a half-hearted attempt at trying to convince us it was raining. No such attempt was made.
Instead, we were told to get over it, suck it up and move on.
Normally, we’d write a “Fuck you” letter and leave it at that, but we still felt that Hiester just didn’t get it. So we spelled it out.
You seem confused.
We were canceled because Ben Bailey rescheduled?
It doesn’t really matter why we were canceled. We were canceled. Period.
It’s not personal at all. We don’t maintain that you’re a bad person. We maintain that you’re an inadequate businessperson.
We’ve had people cancel out on us, but they offer us a date. Note the difference: They offer us a specific date and they don’t just say, “I’ll offer you another date,” and leave it at that. And, since the only weekend we’ve ever booked with you was canceled with five weeks notice, we have to wonder why we would accept the offer of another date as adequate compensation for what was done.
Such a vague offer does nothing to placate us (and, since we’re the aggrieved party here, a bit of placating is in order).
Others offer the specific date and they also offer us more money for our trouble– which is what re-booking a date already on the books is– It’s an inconvenience to have to re-book a date. And, yes, there is loss there, as time is not infinite. We’ve had people compensate us 100 per cent– effectively pay us to stay home!– because they crunched the numbers and found it better to pay us off (thereby avoiding alienating us and destroying the business relationship) in order to follow through on whatever plan they had.
We’ve also had situations where one of us was kept on the bill and an arrangement was made for a rebooking of both acts later.
Offering another, specific date and then offering more money on top of the deal might demonstrate that you are interested in keeping some sort of relationship with us. It would be a good faith effort to make up for the short-notice cancellation. (Instead, we’re told that we’re not in any position to complain, that we’re not losing anything and that we’re taking it all too personally.)
Your greed is the only reason that you think you “have no control over the reschedule date for Ben.” If you had any loyalty or any business sense, you’d politely refuse to book Ben until an open date is on the calendar or you would book him into the March 20/21 date and compensate us somehow. Of course, it’s a good thing to bring in 10 or 15 grand into the club (and probably get press on top of it)– what club wouldn’t want to do that? But to do so while treating us in such a crass manner says that you have tremendous regard for comedians only when they’re capable of generating such revenue. And that those who don’t are interchangeable and their troubles are not worthy of your time and consideration.
You didn’t even inquire as to whether we were available for the Feb. 27-28 date. Of course, we’re not– we’re booked elsewhere– but we were not given a chance to refuse the date.
So you had ample opportunity to avoid alienating us–
You could have immediately offered us a date in the future (a real date, not a theoretical one)
You could have offered us a date (and thrown in more money for our trouble)
You could have offered us the date that Ben Bailey vacated.
You could have offered the feature spot on what was previously our weekend (with an offer for a future date)
You could have taken some of the profits from the Ben Bailey weekend and paid us off for anywhere from 50 per cent to 100 per cent of what we would have made.
You could have inquired (after explaining your predicament) as to whether we would be willing to take the same money but drop down to Feature and Emcee on the Ben Bailey shows. A win-win-win (if we were to accept the arrangement), as it would have gotten you not one, not two, but three quality headliners on the bill for the premium $18 ticket price– for not much more money than you are going to spend anyway. (And, it’s an arrangement that we might actually have agreed to if you had asked, as there is precious little chance that we’re going to be able to re-book the date with only five weeks to go.)
Instead, you delay telling us about the cancellation (we should have been the first people you called), you tell us that we have plenty of time to re-book the date and you clearly say on the voicemail that you are too busy to take a phone call on the matter because you’re cleaning up the mess made by the Ben Bailey cancellation. (And in your follow-up emails and voicemail, you manage to insult us, express your annoyance and tell us that we’re “taking it personally.”
And you offer us some vague date in the future (which you are too busy to actually nail down right now because you’re so busy trying to recover some or all of the $10,000 in revenue from the cancelled tickets). And, I really don’t want to hear about how much of a guarantee Ben Bailey is commanding– he’s obviously going to turn you a nice profit if you’re willing to anger two professional comedians (with 50+ years combined experience) living within 75 miles of your club. So unnecessary.
And pretty sorry. Especially considering what little it would have taken to make us happy.
We have yet to hear a response. We don’t expect to get one.
In these times of economic uncertainty, it’s rather disconcerting to be told that the cancellation of a date with five weeks is “no loss,” and that re-booking the date with some other venue in some other location with just five weeks notice is no problem.
The takeaway: It might not be a good idea to count on a booking from someone who regards a short-notice cancellation as no loss, and who is so cavalier about a professional comedian losing out on income. (We point out that the date in question was booked months ago. What makes that same booker think that a similar date can materialize in a fraction of that time?)
After a bit of back and forth with Hiester, we found ourselves in the position of actually spelling out for him exactly how he might have handled the situation better. Should we really have to be doing that?
There are people in this business who get it. In fact, we’ve posted about three of them within the past week. And then, there are the Todd Hiesters of the world.
12 Responses
Reply to: Reading (PA), writing and arithmetic
On the advice of counsel, I cannot comment on club owners, bookers or managers. My lawyer is Thumper’s Mom.
This is an unfortunate story and an all too common one. Bad business practices in comedy is just the norm…. People dont get into comedy because they’re good business men. When it comes to how well you’ll be treated in this industry, it has a lot to do with how much value you bring to the table. Stand-Up has a supply and demand problem… there’s no shortage of no-name comedians that can do a good job, so bookers dont mind ignoring the ones that give them trouble. When you become a national headliner like Ben, then the tables turn. A national headliner means people are coming to see you VS a regular headliner where people came to see a comedy show and you’re the third guy on.
I, for one, do not mind using Shecky for this type of reporting. I wouldn’t mind seeing Shecky used more often like this to expose these shady bookers.My hunch: This club will go under soon, that’s why they don’t worry about sound business practices.
Dick Holder writes:“I wouldn’t mind seeing Shecky used more often like this to expose these shady bookers.”Well, there are plenty of sites out there that bitch about condos and bad bookers and low pay (and who allow their readers or contributors to do the same), so we’re not about to start doing that on a regular basis.In certain isolated cases, though, we think our experience serves as a lesson and might afford us an opportunity to provide a vocabulary or a way of thinking or talking about certain situations And when we do, we try to remain generally positive, upbeat and point more toward solutions rather than merely grousing.As to your hunch that the club will go under soon, well, since it’s in a rather small market and since there probably won’t be any competition any time soon, we suspect that it won’t be going under any time soon.One thing is for sure: It’ll continue on without us.
you didn’t have a contract for the date?
Ricardo:
Much of what you say is true. However, any good businessman understands that he can’t book his room 52 weeks out of the year with Ben Baileys– the economics just don’t work out.
So, he must cultivate decent relationships with “no-name comedians” if he is to book his room efficiently and with a minimum of friction.
To be sure, the vast majority of comedians have little leverage when compared to that of Ben Bailey or similar comics. But in spite of the supply and demand figures, a booker would be foolish to view the comedians that seek to do business with him as interchangeable parts.
And we take issue that “bad business practices… is just the norm.” We cited at least three clubs that are scrupulous and that treat the comedians with more than the minimum of respect. There are more than just the three, of course.
If all a club seeks out are “comedians who can do a good job,” the quality of their shows will be eclipsed by clubs that seek out better comics and comics who deliver quality performances. And they’ll be eclipsed by clubs that realize that there is value in maintaining a good relatinship with such comedians.
The tables turn, you say. Indeed they do. For both comic and for booker. If only in light of that, would it not be a good idea to maintain a decent relationship, so that when the tables do turn, the retribution won’t be so harsh?
It is only fools who approach the business of talent booking with a slash and burn attitude. If suspicion and disregard are the guiding principles when booking a room, the rewards will be few and the retribution will be certain.
I hope you emailed a link to this article to the club owner.
No, we did not email a link to the club owner. It would serve no purpose.Our last contact with him was the email that is blockquoted in our posting.We said what we had to say and no more needed to be said.
We had an agreement, but no contract on paper.
Before any of our readers seeks to bore us all with some sort of legal datribe about contract law we will remind you that the vast majority of comedians operate without formal contracts.
And if someone thinks for one second that the lack of a paper contract– either downloaded from the internet or drawn up by a lawyer friend or purchased from LegalZoom.com– gives either party the right to break an agreement with impunity, I would remind him that most verbal agreements in this business are honored.
And those that aren’t honored are usually re-worked to the satisfaction of both parties, with proper consideration given to the aggrieved parties and some sort of compensation offered and some sort of compromise reached.
And it is usually pretty clear to both parties as to who behaved in a manner that was in violation of the agreement.
If someone were to say that comics at this level, making these kind of agreements, are vulnerable merely because of the absence of a paper contract, we would say that he is being unrealistic and is ignoring reality.
The vast majority of agreements in the vast majority of venues (clubs, private parties, nightclubs, even casinos) are reached without benefit of a contract. Somehow they almost all are honored to the satisfaction of all the parties involved.
Do we have little or no recourse because we didn’t insist on one? You could say so. But it is rarely the case that anyone breaks an agreement in such a manner. It has been our experience that most folks behave ethically and morally even without the paper.
In the freelance writing biz, I don’t need a contract with an editor. It’s verbal, too. And if for some reason the publication doesn’t run the piece (space, they changed their mind, they aren’t satisfied with it and don’t think it can be fixed — that’s never happened to me, by the way!), you get a kill fee for your efforts. It’s all about maintaining relationships with the freelancers they need to fill out their publications. The same would hold true for comedy clubs, I’d have thought. But I guess not always.
Guy speaks the truth.
We’ve done some writing and/or video production here and there for publications or other entities. And we’ve always been pleasantly surprised when we find that the industry standard is to offer a kill fee or a version of it.
In those businesses, it’s acknowledged that everyone’s time is precious.
Of course, it is also generally acknowledged in standup that everyone’s time has value. But some less reputable people ignore that in an effort to save a buck and at the risk of jeopardizing relationships.
You should have called your comic friend Jeff. I would have broken his legs for you.